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Question : Is koi more closely related to japanese or chinese carp ?

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Question : Is koi more closely related to japanese or chinese carp ?

Post by alexmtl on Wed Jul 20, 2016 8:04 pm

Question : Is koi more closely related to japanese or chinese carp ?

Answer to follow. What do you think ?
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Re: Question : Is koi more closely related to japanese or chinese carp ?

Post by ksimdjembe on Fri Jul 22, 2016 8:25 pm

Aren't carp from Chinese origin and that the breeding was adopted by the Japanese? So.... both?
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Re: Question : Is koi more closely related to japanese or chinese carp ?

Post by alexmtl on Fri Jul 29, 2016 7:37 pm

Question : Is koi more closely related to japanese or chinese carp ?

This is a tricky question to answer. Confusion and bad information is propagated on this question and recent genetic studies have revealed interesting and different thinking.

The origin of koi carp is derived from the common carp (Cyprinus carpio).

Goldfish originated from the crucian carp in China, with proper scientific nomenclature is given to a complex rather than a single species, Carassius auratus complex. There are thought to be 7 subforms within this complex. Studies indicate that the Grass goldfish subform is likely the first domesticated breed of Chinese goldfish. (Wang S-Y, Luo J, Murphy RW, Wu S-F, Zhu C-L, et al. (2013) Origin of Chinese Goldfish and Sequential Loss of Genetic Diversity Accompanies New Breeds.

Contrary to the belief in Japan that the koi carps have been developed directly from carp stocks in Japan, Mabuchi et al suggests that the Japanese koi carp has originated from Chinese Oujiang color carp subform. (Kohji Mabuchi, Hayeun Song Mito DNA (2014) The complete mitochondrial genome of the Japanese ornamental koi carp (Cyprinus carpio) and its implication for the history of koi.

Answer : Koi is more related to Chinese common carp.
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Re: Question : Is koi more closely related to japanese or chinese carp ?

Post by Sbenson11 on Sat Jul 30, 2016 7:03 pm

Not really sure how to answer that question,

It wasn't until around 1500 that Chinese carp were introduced to Japan. They were raised in the rice fields, dried and salted for food. Around 1800 color mutations were first noticed in these small fish (Higoi) After selective cross breeding many of the main strains we see today were stabilized by the end of the 1800's.

So the Nishikigoi(Koi) that we know today are from the Cyprinus Carpio (Chinese Common Carp) if that's the answer you looking for.

It's sort of a trick question Smile

Steve
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